Geoffrey Thorne recently made a return to the CBR Forums to engage with fans and address questions about his highly anticipated X-Force run.
Some people have raised concerns about the portrayal of the "Native American with red headband" imagery, considering its origins in Hollywood rather than specific cultural attire. I'm curious if you and/or Marcus To have delved into this aspect while developing Forge's character.
Thorne: Hm. We had a lot of discussions about Forge. A LOT. I did considerable research on Cheyenne history, traditions, and current status. None of that will make it into these first issues. Once I'm done writing X-Force, I'll tell the backstage stories and post pages from my first drafts. I make a point of almost never describing how the sausage is made while I'm on a book because there are scumbags who will use frank discussions to gin up controversy in order to get clicks. I'm aggressively anti-scumbag. Bottom line: Forge has a few established looks, and in these first issues, we are using a variation of one of them. That said, THIS time, at least, there's a story reason for the headband.
Could you provide more insight into the concept of X-Force having a revolving cast of guest heroes?
Thorne: Heh. Normally, I wouldn't do this, but I got hammered on the Green Lantern run with covers that revealed plot twists, blurbs that were literally false in their descriptions of what the books contained, and covers that sometimes depicted scenes that never occurred and were never even proposed by me. I'm going to caution everyone, once again, about putting too much stock in these marketing blurbs about our book. I didn't write these marketing blurbs and have no input into them. SOME of what they've said is accurate. Some, like this "rotating guest star" thing, is not. I'm not looking to have to defend myself for failing to fulfill promises I never made. This book will absolutely not be a revolving door of mutant guest stars. Nor will it be a plug-in "mutant of the week" book. This is not Mutant Marvel Team-Up. This is X-Force. Our playing field is the entire Marvel universe. Not saying what it WILL be (SPOILERS), but it will not be either of those things. At all. Put that entirely out of your mind.
I find it particularly exciting to hear that there won't be a revolving door of guest characters in this series.
Thorne: We will be FAST. We will be GLOBAL. We will be RUTHLESS. We will be CONTENTIOUS. We will LIE. We will BETRAY. We will ROLL THAT COASTER as hard as we can. Because we are about winning, about solving the problem for good, not slapping a bandaid on it. And we will, most definitely, be STRANGE.
Will Deadpool be a permanent team member or just a guest star for the initial arc?
Thorne: Wade is 100% a guest. He is not on the team on anything resembling a permanent basis. Whether you love Deadpool or hate Deadpool, you will enjoy what we do with Deadpool.
The issue I have is with Betsy retaining her role as Captain Britain. It seems unrealistic for Britain's top hero to be involved in killing. Personally, I much prefer Betsy as Psylocke. Her transition to Captain Britain doesn't sit well with me.
Thorne: Wait and see.
I'm curious about the mechanics of Betsy's role as Captain Britain. Captain Britain is typically seen as the British equivalent of Captain America, a symbol of heroism. Seeing her on a hit squad feels out of place. Additionally, revealing mutants' involvement in killing could exacerbate existing tensions between mutants and humans. This development has dampened my enthusiasm for the book; I'd prefer to see Betsy return to her Psylocke persona.
Thorne: Wait and see.
My concern about the portrayal of killing ties back to Betsy's identity as Captain Britain. As England's premier hero, it's challenging to reconcile her involvement in lethal activities. X-Force traditionally comprises anti-heroes, so integrating a traditional hero like Captain Britain seems discordant. However, I'm open to seeing how this unfolds in the series.
Thorne: The past won't help you. New deck. New dealers. New game.
What are your thoughts on Betsy's psychic weapons? Are there plans to introduce more medieval-inspired weaponry, or will she predominantly stick to the classic sword and shield?
Thorne: Heh. Lady Braddock will be doing some new stuff, for sure.
Are there any unresolved X-issues that you will be revisiting? Additionally, will there be brand-new villains introduced in this series?
Thorne: New villains, yes. And some [I hope, engaging] spins on old ones. I don't plan on revisiting anything, not the way I think you mean. That said, while the Krakoa era will have come to an end by the time we debut, the ripple effect from all that will have ongoing consequences on the characters in the book. The rise and fall of Krakoa is a significant and, I think, traumatic event to many, many mutants in the X-verse. It would be poor storytelling to ignore that.
Is there any possibility of Cable showing up in X-Force?
Thorne: I have no problems with Cable. He can be fun. But he's got too much gravity for the stories I tell. Any book he's in becomes a Cable book and I'm not here to tell Cable stories or have the story I want to tell transformed into a Cable book. I can't speak to what anyone else is doing with ANY of the characters people want to see but there are a bunch of us with a bunch more series and minis to be announced and a LOT of mutants unaccounted for.
Will Betsy's history with Warren be addressed in this series, or will there be any interaction between them? I'm not a fan of Betsy and Rachel as a couple.
Thorne: I dunno about other writers but nobody controls my narratives but me and, to some degree, the editor. Betsy's with Rachel now, that's the canon. Every character carries their personal history with them just like we all do. MANY queer people go through years or even decades pretending to be straight for their own reasons (usually tied to self-preservation in a hostile society) before coming out. Some, tragically, never do. I've got a sibling who went through this and it was extremely painful for them and for me be unable to help them through it beyond just being supportive of their struggle and their decisions. Betsy and Rachel are now canonically bisexual and, currently, in love with one another. Betsy and Warren certainly did happen and, should they meet up again in X-Force, or elsewhere, I like to think they would remember that time with warmth and happiness. But Betsy is in her own body now and Kwannon's back in hers. When Marvel accepted my pitch for what is now X-Force, Betsy and Rachel were already a couple and a couple they will remain unless there's an EXTREMELY compelling reason to break them up (and I mean EXTREEEEEEEEEEEEMELY compelling). I don't see it happening, frankly. Betsy's romance with Warren will not be rekindled or revisited on my watch. Also, while I love the canon, I hate nostalgia like cancer. We will be moving forward, not backwards.
“For so long, my life has been out of control. Chaos and serendipity, wrapped in insanity. I have suffered, I have lost. Not just my life, but my very soul, my self. But no more. Now I know who I am.” – Elizabeth ‘Betsy’ Braddock, daughter of Otherworld, mutant, telepath, telekinetic, defender of the realm and, above all, X-Man.
24 comments:
As long as Betsy goes by Captain Britain only in name and not looks everything is fine. A new code name would be mana from the sky for her to fit again in the X-Men microcosm.
I like that he's giving so many interviews. I'm kinda excited and I haven't been that in a long time for Betsy. Fingers crossed.
People with issues with Britain's "national hero" killing... Do you know anything about Britain's history?
That being said, Each interview Thorne gives makes me more optimistic. Coupled with how Foxe has been writing Betsy, things seem to be shaping up
Everything the writer says makes me excited to see his work on Betsy and I'm very curious to see what her new outfit will be like on X-Force!
Seems pretty promising!! He did not deny Betsy returning to the Psylocke persona (wait and see), said the past won't matter much and she will be doing new stuff!! Got me actually waiting and eager to see!
Nah marvel keeps Betts chained up with Captain Kettle. Don't get my hopes up tho I see Thorne is wise to distance his work from the trash Coward was puking for years.
I think he can write a much better Betsy than Tini.
But it also feels like as Tini has failed writing Betsy and Rachel relationship. He wants to try it extra hard to make the relationship a thing to prove himself. And this may not end well...
Yeah not thrilled with that part myself.
Warren loved Betsy for who she is.. not her body, but seems like that is kinda his thinking.
Warren gave up a piece of his soul for her in their mini series for crying out loud lol.
You can tell they still have a love for each other in Dissasembled & even in Tini's book Betsy and Warren are together in that universe that she is the queen (and she's definitely in her own body in those).
So far not thrilled at all with Rachel and Betsy, kinda find them boring, but hopefully he can make them exciting.
It was the original poster on CBR who suggested that Warren's affection for Betsy was solely based on her Asian body. Thorne intervened to clarify that although Warren and Betsy did love each other, he has no plans to revisit their relationship in X-Force.
I initially said thanks for clarification, but looked at it again and unless I'm missing something, it says comment is under "Thorne".
"Betsy and Warren certainly did happen and, should they meet up again in X-Force, or elsewhere, I like to think they would remember that time with warmth and happiness. But Betsy is in her own body now and Kwannon's back in hers."
That the comment I am referring to.
Yes, that what was Thorne referring to, in regards to the original poster implying such a thing.
He's being questioned about Betsy's status as Captain Britain quite a lot, isn't he?
It's funny to see people complaining that a Captain Britain couldn't be involved in a antihero team due to being the equivalent to Captain America and such... because Captain America himself has already been part of a secret antihero team in the Secret War miniseries, which basically invaded a foreign nation to take its sovereign down (granted, it was Latveria, but still). Or the two times he invaded Utopia. Or when he had no issues leading superheroes to battle Iron Man and his heroes in populated areas during Civil War (both men were at fault, by the way, as neither of them seemed to care about the civilians endangered by their superhero fights).
And I don't get why some people keep bringing Warren up. Many couples break up and move on with their lives, so I don't see why they should be stuck with each other. And it's not like their relationship was a huge part of their backstory, like Cyclops and Jean, or Rogue and Gambit.
@FSaker Betsy had a solid identity in Psylocke and her mutant psychic powers are her signature move set. Captain Britain is an insane departure from Betsy's physical tactician and clandestine assassin characterization. Magic captaining has hindered her stories and growth after her return in Uncanny X-Men disassembled. Fans voice their distaste to the point of outrage reasonably for losing their familiar hero to a Union Flag pretender.
As for Warren and Betsy relationship they are mindmeld and joined to their souls. The one thing Tonight Howard got right was that Betsy is Warren's Queen across the multi verse.
Agree with everything @Jaime Braz said.
I personally don't think CB fits with Betsy's lethal edge, much better fitted to Brian.
Also Brian needs the suit because it grants him powers, Betsy already has them.
She's more than enough as herself. She doesn't need CB or even Psylocke, I wish that was the story they were telling all along.
Jmo.
Am I the only one who would fancy a Bets/Neal revisit? Has she seen or mentioned him since her resurrection?
And what of poor Agent Gabriel who she was engaged to before Mojo and Spiral kidnapped her? Has she seen or mentioned him?
Bets keeps it movin’. 👀😆
Also, Bets had more chemistry with Fantomex and Cluster than I’ve seen with R’Chell to date. 😆
@X-Man thank you. For a moment I thought I was the crazy one for expressing concerns Betsy was affected negatively by adopting the magic powers of Captain Britain. It is out of character for Betsy pining for her brother's powers acting as she has a chip on her shoulder for Brian being the chosen one. Claremont has addressed this exact detail in his Acts of Vengeance having Betsy expose her inner monologue about said frustrations and finding her voice after being transformed into a killing machine rejoicing for eliminating threats successfully by her bare hands. Even before her notorious transformation Betsy as Psylocke realized her dreams of achieving heroic status by confronting alone Sabretooth in a pink dress and high heels. Giving Betsy her brother's mantle is regressive to a past when Betsy hadn't found a place in the X-Men and her personal voice as Psylocke.
@Rahsaan you are not alone thinking of Shaara. In one of the AIPT call for questions for X-Men Monday I asked the same question expressing chemistry compatibility between Betsy and Neal that was cut short due to her planned death. The question never made it to print and after some time I discovered the reason for they were planning to pair Betsy with Rachel changing their friendship into sexual lust.
I didn't like Neal & Betsy. Especially when she said she put on some traditional garb one time because she wanted to please him.
Just didn't sound like her to me. Sounded out of character.
I also didn't care for Neal flirting with someone in a relationship. Didnt seem that honorable to me (on both their parts to be honest).
If they had a better foundation maybe, but can't say I ever liked them.
That said, I rather them together than her and Fantomex.
I rather Betsy and Rachel together than Betsy and Fantomex & that says a lot lol.
Agreed and worse than that to me, was despite the fact i felt extra powers were uneeded, Betsy took down Storm (an Omega), and a transformed Angel/Archangel not to mention was pretty authoritive as well in Dissasembled.
So CB should have made her almost unstoppable, yet she seemed imho much much weaker than she did in Dissasembled.
Betsy as CB just doesn't work for me. Its off.
If they do indeed do a story where she realizes she has always been more than enough all along and doesn't need any title, I would be very happy.
@Jaime,
Neal and Bets had good chemistry. However, I would not go as far as referring to Bets and Rachel as lustful. Their romantic relationship had never been written as overly sexual or driven primarily by sex, so I think lustful as an adjective feels a bit hyperbolic. The attraction between Bets and Scott was lustful as was the one between her and the Nathan clones. With her and Rachel, it just seems kind of boring and Howard’s lead-up seemed more about Rachel idolizing Bets almost like a sycophant. I’m curious to see if Thorne writes them in a more balanced way that feels organic.
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